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atheling

Jonathan Powell:

I wouldn't trust wikipedia for facts.

It's a joke here in the US that a "redneck" owns a pickup truck, guns and dogs.

There are MANY Ameericans who are middle class who fit that category... and they are business owners, farmers, lawyers, police, etc... And I speak of personal knowledge.

Jonathan Powell

It's a joke here in the US that a "redneck" owns a pickup truck, guns and dogs.

Well, that's not the definition I had in mind! (maaybe the pickup truck...)

I tend to think of a redneck as someone who at best is like Larry the Cable Guy, and at worst has a penchant for white sheets...

mamapajamas

Jonathan, re: "I mean, the Republicans--especially the current administration--haven't exactly done much to close the loopholes you refer to, and have introduced plenty of corporate welfare to benefit their supporters..."

The "administration" has very little to do with tax policy (the president might recommend things, but Congress actually writes the tax legislation). And the Republicans LOST their majority in Congress specifically BECAUSE they have never behaved like a majority party. They let the Democrats walk all over them. THAT is why they lost Congress.

re: "I may be true that the Republican policies are de facto better for the middle-class, but that just means the Dem's policies are misguided, not that their designed to screw the middle-class."

The Democratic PARTY is under the control of "progressives" who are nothing but warmed over Marxists. The middle class is and always shall be the primary target of Marxists.

The use of the term "progressive" would have me rolling on the floor laughing if the situation weren't as serious as it actually is. "Progressive"???? 19th Century ideas that failed in the 20th have NO place in the 21st.

atheling

Who's Larry the Cable Guy?

Kevin Sampson

"Rednecks span from the poor to the working class."

"Anyway, even if they overlap my point was that liberals don't despise the middle-class as such, but instead despise rednecks who might or might not be middle-class." - Jonathon Powell

So, liberals hate rednecks, who are drawn from the ranks of the poor or working class. Yet it is the liberals who unfailingly paint themselves as champions of the poor and working class. Does the phrase 'cognitive dissonance' mean anything to you? Or is that the liberals only champion those poor and working class people whose ideology they find acceptable?

Jonathan Powell

Who's Larry the Cable Guy?

He's the fictional persona of a comedian, a bit like Borat. See his website.

He always wears a sleeveless shirt because under the Constitution he has the right to bare arms (get it?).

So, liberals hate rednecks, who are drawn from the ranks of the poor or working class. Yet it is the liberals who unfailingly paint themselves as champions of the poor and working class. Does the phrase 'cognitive dissonance' mean anything to you? Or is that the liberals only champion those poor and working class people whose ideology they find acceptable?

In my view, liberals do not "unfailingly" champion the poor and working class, but rather special interest groups within these cohorts, e.g. members of labour unions, Blacks, etc.

Anyway, even though they might champion the poor qua poor, this tends to be in a rather patronizing, cynical way and is not inconsistent with despising their values.

In other words, the issue of class is not important, except in the case of the rich, who are despised by the Left as a group (even though rich individuals are deemed OK so long as they join the liberal cause). So again I say that "middle-America" is despised for it's values, and includes the poor and middle-class alike (and, arguably, the rich, e.g. President Bush could be said to represent middle-America).

atheling

"even though they might champion the poor qua poor, this tends to be in a rather patronizing, cynical way and is not inconsistent with despising their values."

Well, then they actually don't "champion" the poor if they despise their values, do they?

Jonathan Powell

Well, then they actually don't "champion" the poor if they despise their values, do they?

Your missing the point: not all poor people share the same values, nor do all middle-class people, etc. So, liberals may champion the cause of poor people--by arguing for redistributive taxation, for instance--whilst despising some or all of them for other reasons, e.g. for being rednecks.

Jessica Bigham

I think the "f--- middle america" sign was funny, and I live in Middle America! Middle America's conservatism does bother me. These are the people who voted for Bush a second time.

"Imperialist America is Humanity's Number 1 Enemy" isn't offensive to me at all.

That being said, the other signs are just crazy. I'm as liberal as you get, and this isn't liberalism it's mean. Those crazy Phelps people say the same thing. There are crazy conservatives and liberals.

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